No signs of shutting up yet
Just shut up. It's over. You are not going to convince 190 of the remaining 205 superdelegates to back you.
Ken Vogel reports that the Clinton campaign is using the (Puerto Rico) results to openly argue that Barack Obama has a problem with Hispanic voters — an idea Clinton backers have previously mentioned only behind the scenes..
posted by mikevotes at
5:29 PM
8 Comments:
Is anyone but the groupies still listen ing to the Clinton campaign?
1) Are the Clintons and their cadre of political strongmen quickly fading into irrelevance? With each passing day are they cementing their image as thugs and whiners, willing to bend any rule and tell any tale to grab power?
2) Are these Clinton "supporters" we've seen and read about lately really just a handful of zealots. A group who's numbers appear larger and who's influence appears greater, only because the media are fascinated by them and giving them disproportionate attention?
I'm beginning to think that all this "divided Democratic part" talk is just sensationalism to sell papers. Perhaps the overwhelming majority of Hillary voters are not as torn up about this as the Clintons would have us believe. I suspect that Hillary has jumped the shark. Voters have -- or will soon -- moved on. Clinton now risking serious and permanent damage to her image and political future.
By
-epm, at 8:28 PM
1. Yes. I think the Ickes appearance on Meet the Press this morning captured that pretty clearly as Russert sputtered in disbelief at the unreal answers.
2. Yes and no. It is definitely a small subset of Clinton supporters, but there are more than a few, and many more who hold the viewpoints less strongly.
I think there are some real emotions, but they're definitely scalable.
Even if the Clinton supporters don't volunteer or donate (which alot of them will by the end) the vast majority are still going to vote Dem in the fall.
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mikevotes, at 9:30 PM
Well, now that she won PR, Hillary's looking stronger than ever. Of course, Puerto Rico can't vote in the general election, but now she's free to move on to Brazil, Guyana, and Costa Rica. I understand Obama isn't even on the ballot in any other countries, which is just a dumb move on his part.
But all snark aside, if the current conflict is as the media has shown it, Hillary is in big trouble. This is the electoral equivalent of suicide bombing. If Obama wins the GE, Hillary may be cast as a toothless spent force. If McCain wins the GE, Hillary may be cast as a betrayer of the Party on a scale that will make Nader seem like a saint.
That's why I'm sincerely hoping that we're seeing a lunatic fringe and possibly even a good many Republicans masquerading as Democrats. The Party doesn't need this and Hillary doesn't need this. She needs to make some speeches to chill out her supporters. This would be an excellent show of good faith for someone who has not shown much of it in the campaign, and help her gain whatever it is she wants from the DNC.
If she can't do that, then she isn't the leader that these lunatics apparently think she is.
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Todd Dugdale , at 11:50 PM
That's a pretty funny joke. Obama's not even on the ballot in Brazil, so Clinton expects to gain some popular vote.....
And I don't necessarily view some of these people as lunatic, I think they're just the most passionate wedge of supporters.
Clinton will eventually swing in. What I'm watching for is how much she goes to the trail for the Dem nominee. That will be the code.
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mikevotes, at 7:35 AM
Hillary (and even Bill) will stump for the Dem nominee in direct proportion to the political power and influence they perceive they'll gain from such an effort. If Hillary thinks she'll be more powerful and influential by "going Lieberman," then she'll go Lieberman. If she thinks her political agenda (whatever it really is) is better served by recasting herself as the Great Unifier of the Party (a combination of selfless martyr and Solomonic wisdom) then that's what she'll do.
The question remains: What does Hillary want? Short of being anointed Queen of the Empire. To some degree, she's been a chameleon of personalities throughout this campaign... a regular Sybil. There's been only one constant: fighting to get what she wants and any cost.
Let's face it. With the level of low-ball politics we've seen from Clinton supporters, surrogates and campaign officials, (not to mention Bill and Hill) I'd rather have her as a political ally than an enemy. But I think the Democratic Party baton has already been passed and The Clintons are so... 1999.
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-epm, at 9:47 AM
I'd buy the opportunist argument, but I don't see opportunity in going Lieberman.
And what she wants, and what she realistically can get at this point may be divergent.
I think she could pull alot of legacy saving and fundraising help, but I don't think she has the pull anymore to really force herself in anywhere.
If she wanted to do that, around NC Indiana was the time.
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mikevotes, at 10:55 AM
I don't see any opportunity in going Lieberman either. I'm just suggesting if she saw and opportunity for herself, she'd go independent... a party unto herself. I do believe she and Lieberman view politics through the similar lens.
However, as I said earlier, I think she's jumped the political shark. I'm really not sure how large her following is. However large it is, it's smaller now than it was in the beginning of this.
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-epm, at 11:39 AM
Yeah. The question is, what does her reputation, positive/negative look like in 2 years after the emotions have died down?
By
mikevotes, at 1:30 PM
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