Did this affect Dick Cheney?
From the NYTimes' excerpt on Jane Mayer's book,
The White House has since issued a statement saying "no one remembers" this incident, but I think that's garbage. Mayer wouldn't make this up. The question I would have is whether Cheney changed his views before and after this incident. We know he was pushing Iraq before Oct 18, but how avidly was he pushing torture, wiretapping, etc?
Did Dick Cheney's phantom near death experience change our country forever?
Also, Frank Rich has an interesting collection of bits from the Mayer book (if you can cut through the Frank Richiness.)
“The Dark Side” also describes a frightening false alarm at the White House on Oct. 18, 2001, when, it says, an alarm went off on a machine designed to detect biological, chemical or radiological attacks. According to the book, among those who believed they might have been exposed to a pathogen was Vice President Dick Cheney.
The White House has since issued a statement saying "no one remembers" this incident, but I think that's garbage. Mayer wouldn't make this up. The question I would have is whether Cheney changed his views before and after this incident. We know he was pushing Iraq before Oct 18, but how avidly was he pushing torture, wiretapping, etc?
Did Dick Cheney's phantom near death experience change our country forever?
Also, Frank Rich has an interesting collection of bits from the Mayer book (if you can cut through the Frank Richiness.)
posted by mikevotes at
7:43 AM
6 Comments:
And how would have and actual death experience (god forbid) have affected the country? I'm gonna guess, for the better.
By
-epm, at 2:17 PM
Hard to say. Don't know who would have come in, but on Oct. 18, 2001, I'm pretty sure it wouldn't have been a moderate.
By
mikevotes, at 2:36 PM
You're right... This was so early in the Bush administration I don't think anyone but the inner cabal had any idea how viral Cheney was vis a vis the inner machinations of forming this administration's policies. It was only later that the whole Darth Cheney thing emerged.
Still, I think there's something peculiar about Cheney, as a person, that goes beyond moderate vs. conservative. I think a properly vetted VP -- no matter how conservative and even in the early post 9/11 period -- simply wouldn't have had the cross-institutional muscle to exert the coercive influence that Cheney uniquely could.
By
-epm, at 2:51 PM
Mike,
I'm going to disagree with you here on a couple of angles. First, Cheney was a certifiable paranoiac well before October '01 who longed for a "Pearl Harbor-like event." He and Rumsfeld participated in, or more accurately ran, change-of-government drills in the 1980s in which they went and hid in bunkers for days at a time every year. He's been doing this "undisclosed location" routine for decades. This
Likewise, Cheney single-mindedly planned to take power at least since the failure of GHWB to seize Iraq in 1991. His level of activity in setting up the Presidency was remarkable, and he was the first Vice President to actually nominate himself. Well before he did, the group he orchestrated (PNAC) came right out and said they were going after the Mid-East as soon as they were able.
What changed our country forever was having this lunatic bulldozer in the White House to begin with, and his panic episode didn't change Cheney's pre-set course one iota.
By
MarcLord, at 3:09 PM
EPM, Cheney's installation was unique.
Adding on to Marclord's comment, First, Cheney vetted and recommended himself. Then, he was head of the transition team so that Bush allowed him to place the people he wanted where he wanted. That's why the Cheney folks had such power. They owned the levers at the Pentagon, and had subordinate spies/doers in other places like Dept of State.
He came in knowing exactly what he wanted to do with regards of taking over.
....
Marclord, yes, he was irrationally pro-hawk Iraq before he came in. As I said above, he came in with the intention of taking over, but.....
My opinion is that Cheney is not a personally brave man. He likes to think he's "tough" or whatever, but his "toughness" all involves other people's costs.
My hunch is that, faced with death by terrorist, it would only amplify whatever was in him before.
(And yes, he came in with the ideas of a expanded presidential powers, too. It's like a "perfect storm" of a bad power hungry guy being put in a situation where no one would stop him.)
By
mikevotes, at 4:30 PM
Some volume dials go up to 11, so amplification of whatever was in him before I will buy. A real fear and anger machine.
By
MarcLord, at 12:24 PM
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