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Born at the Crest of the Empire

Friday, January 16, 2009

This is messed up.....

I understand this is a bit out of context, and that his point is that he could mobilize his people as a force for good, but it's still pretty messed up for Rick Warren to cite Hitler, Lenin, and Mao as models of how he wants to organize and motivate his followers.


  • I like Rick Warren and I understand what he was trying to say. However this was, at the least, a very poor choice of words.

    By Blogger Patrick, at 11:37 AM  

  • That's what I'm saying.

    He was trying to create inspire commitment and movement, but that's a creepy way to hit the point.

    I mean, he coulda gone with American Revolution, or civil rights or whatever.

    By Blogger mikevotes, at 1:55 PM  

  • Here's the thing. Organized religion isn't interested in grass roots, community organizer organizations, they're interested in top-down control of their masses.

    I'm ambivalent toward Warren. But the fact that he sees rigid, uncompromising, fascist organizations, as the model to motivate/manipulate "right thinking" masses... Well, that's just odd. And a little disturbing.

    By Blogger -epm, at 2:06 PM  

  • I'm a-religious and generally pretty skeptical of the organizations, but I don't think Rick Warren is trying to create an army of Nazi Youth.

    (Of course, I would have thought that about Pat Robertson, etc, but now we find those Liberty University people making significant policy decisions in the Republican governments.)

    This is a little out of context, pulled out of a larger speech, but it is pretty weird.

    (And keep in mind that there's a substantial gay presence still trying to tear down/pry Warren from the inauguration.)

    By Blogger mikevotes, at 2:18 PM  

  • No, no, no. I'm not suggesting that Warren likes the Nazi Youth message! Just that he likes the model of an uncompromising, highly controlled, dogmatic, top-down command structure. A model that puts all the power in the hands of the guy at the top.

    It's about the power. It's about control. It's about snuffing out diversity and debate.

    As I said I'm ambivalent toward the man. I think he means to be a kinder, gentler fundamentalist. But even if he strives for different ends, I'm slightly disturbed by what he sees as the model by which to bring about those ends. You know?

    By Blogger -epm, at 2:44 PM  

  • It's about organizing like minded people to "take over."

    "Give me a hundred dedicated men...."

    I don't really know if it's about Warren, I don't know enough about the guy to judge, plus I don't really want to fight anybody over this.

    I just thought it was creepy enough to blog.

    By Blogger mikevotes, at 3:19 PM  

  • Now if Obama had used those names he'd been ran out of the US on a rail.

    Funny how it's not obscene when the GOP says it.

    By Blogger matt, at 3:26 PM  

  • Now if Obama had used those names he'd been ran out of the US on a rail.

    Funny how it's not obscene when the GOP says it.

    By Blogger matt, at 3:26 PM  

  • I think it's more Rick Warren than GOP. He seems to have been adopted as the mainstream religious spokesman.

    (And Obama helped him to that plateau, so there should be some interesting give and take.)

    By Blogger mikevotes, at 4:22 PM  

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